[Nicolai P. Zwar]

I thought if anyone can be found, it just hast to be an Indian film composer. 🙂
Though Ilaiyaraaja’s fame seems to be more reginal, not international like Morricone, so I don’t know if I would consider him a “major” film composer. I mean, while I know the name, I don’t think I’ve ever seen a movie he scored or have an album of his music in my collection. Not even sure I ever heard anything by him. (Not that I consider that a reliable benchmark for anything.)

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Horner/Apted is an interesting choice. My own choice for Horner was his Ron Howard work, which is also rather underrated in the scheme of things (most normies are only familiar with the Cameron and Gibson, if that). As for Apted, I’d argue that even though GORKY PARK remains a favourite for many, CLASS ACTION and THUNDERHEART don’t exactly light up the scene – but especially CLASS ACTION is better than its reputation. (There are other Apted scores I put above Horner’s).

I’d have thought Horner/Howard are more “known” again… though of course not as known as Williams/Spielberg or Morricone/Leone.
Anyway, GORKY PARK, CLASS ACTION and THUNDERHEART are all three among my favorite Horner scores. Especially THUNDERHEART I already championed back in the days of rec.music.movies, I think it’s perhaps Horner’s best mostly electronic score. And CLASS ACTION is just the perfect album for those melancholy days when you want to vanish in your thoughts.

[GerateWohl]

As big Miklós Rózsa fan I also find the collaboration between Rózsa and Billy Wilder worth mentioning.
Which resulted in some great works of Rózsa like Double Indemnity, The Lost Weekend, The Private Life of Sherlock Holmes and Fedora.
For Sherlock Holmes Rózsa even sacrificed his violin concerto.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Double Indemnity and The Lost Weekend are among my all time favorite Rózsa scores.

[Thor Joachim Haga]

Though Ilaiyaraaja’s fame seems to be more reginal, not international like Morricone, so I don’t know if I would consider him a “major” film composer.

Depends on where you are in the world, I suppose. He’s definitely one of the most ‘major’ in India and the surrounding region. But the exact number of Ilaiyaraaja’s dramatic instrumental underscores (rather than songs) remain uncertain. Wikipedia says about 1500, which is more than three times that of Morricone, but I’ve found that many of the Wiki entries for Indian artists are added by Indians themselves, who go way overboard with their adulations and exaggerations. I hope some day, there will be a more sober account of the actual number, with all the correct parameters in place.

I’d have thought Horner/Howard are more “known” again…

Perhaps, but as with the rather famous Zemeckis/Silvestri, which was also mentioned and which I also put down as underrated, the under-rating isn’t so much in terms of fame here, but rather towards another meaning of the term – they’re not really rated highly enough for their quality in the scheme of things, outside our litte film music circle.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Depends on where you are in the world, I suppose.

Of course, very true, lots of things depend on where you are in the world. And I view things clearly from a perspective of the Western World (obviously). Hence I said, I consider international renown part of the game. Of course, India is the most populous country in the world… one might say that composers known in all of India and/or all of China are super-famous when it comes to sheer numbers of people who know them, even if no one knows them outside of the country. So these things are of course relative and dependent on perspective.
Wikipedia says about Ilaiyaraaja that he “provided film scores(!) for about 1,523 feature films in nine languages” in a 49 year long career, now that’s some feat, that’s some 30 film scores per year! Not to mention all the other stuff that he’s been doing. I wonder if he really wrote 30 film scores per year, of if he contributed only a piece or song for some of these movies, or if some movies are counted that just used his music. I have no idea. In any case, a highly impressive achievement, I give that. So far, the most prolific film composer I have heard of.

[Thor Joachim Haga]

Yes, whatever the correct number is (when you account for all the right parameters — dramatic instrumental score [not just songs], not merely reuse of themes [which of course also Morricone and Sarde and Horner and other prolific composers have done to lesser extents], not merely a small contribution etc. etc.), it’s incredibly impressive. Regardless of the strain on quality that this workload must have, when you basically do 2-3 film scores a month(!).

[Malte Müller]

I have found that Wikipedia, IMDB and other sources are very unreliable especially in composer credits. Often they are plain wrong or just a track appeares as source music to have them listed. Same as media often referring to some pop stars having “written” the film music for a film while they actually just have sang a song for it and sometimes not even the title song.

[Thor Joachim Haga]

Oh yes, don’t even get me started on erroneous credits, especially in interactive databases like Wiki and IMDB. That’s a big – and separate – discussion.

[Thor Joachim Haga]

Zemeckis/Silvestri hasn’t been mentioned yet. But I personally might find that partnership overrated. But probably just because I find most of Zemeckis’ movies overrated. Has little to do with the scores.

As I mentioned earlier, I consider this underrated (in fact, it was one of the 15 pairs I selected in the article). Not because of fame, but because the quality doesn’t get enough credit outside our niche. My favourite remains CAST AWAY, followed by CONTACT and FORREST GUMP. Yes, that’s right. No BACK TO THE FUTURE!

– Fellini/Rota

Super famous pair, of course. Even outside our niche, and especially in cineaste circles. Was never a big fan of either director or the Rota scores for his movies. There are other Rota collaborations and works I prefer more. But I do like LA DOLCE VITA.

– Sautet/Sarde
– Lautner/Sarde

Sarde had some good relationships. I’m not familiar with the Sautet work, really, but I love the Lautner. I have the special Sarde/Lautner CD that was released on Universal France.

– Polanski/Komeda

Another rather “hip” relationship, especially ROSEMARY’S BABY. But that’s almost an evergreen. There’s more interesting stuff going on in CUL-DE-SAC, KNIFE IN THE WATER and THE FEARLESS VAMPIRE KILLERS. My favourite Polanski collaboration, however, is easily BITTER MOON and Vangelis. Shame there was only that one collaboration.

– Truffaut/Delerue

Another iconic relationship, really, but perhaps somewhat underrated still in the cineaste community? I thought so, and decided to include that among the 15 pairs as well.

– Leone/Morricone (only 6 if you don’t count Leone produced ones)

Massively popular pair, one of the most popular in the world, and certainly not underrated. Usually mentioned in the same breath as Williams/Spielberg and Herrmann/Hitchcock. ONCE UPON A TIME IN THE WEST will always remain one of my top, top favourite Morricone scores. But there are plenty other Morricone collaborations that are worth highlighting. Tall Guy mentioned some up there; my pick would maybe be Sergio Corbucci.

– Besson/Serra

Always been one of my favourite pairs. I love the “big” titles THE BIG BLUE, NIKITA, LEON and THE FIFTH ELEMENT, but perhaps even more some lesser talked-about titles: SUBWAY and especially ATLANTIS, my favourite Serra ever.

[GerateWohl]

Apart from over or underrated I find these director composer pairs especially interesting when (of course according to my personal taste) these collaborations fruited in extraordinarily good scores and I consider the composers work for that particular director better than his usual other works. Like I still think, that Shyamalan evoked Newton Howard’s best scores, same for Marianelli/Wright (except the gorgeous Jane Eyre which might be my favourite Marianelli score, but it was another director).

For example, I wouldn’t callJohn Williams’ scores for Spielberg better than his works for other directors. He more or less delivered brillant scores (and not so brillant ones) in every field.

[Tall Guy]

“Wikipedia says about Ilaiyaraaja that he provided film scores for about 1,523 feature films…”

Also his score in Scrabble.

[Thor Joachim Haga]

For example, I wouldn’t callJohn Williams’ scores for Spielberg better than his works for other directors. He more or less delivered brillant scores (and not so brillant ones) in every field.

Yes, sort of. I think four out of the ten in my top 10 Williams scores ARE Spielberg works. But by all means, so much good stuff elsewhere that rivals and surpasses a great many Spielberg works.

[Thor Joachim Haga]

– Angelopolous/Karaindou

Such an absolutely gorgeous pair – one of my favourites. It’s great to see Karaindrou still active, even in her 80s. My favourite is no doubt THE BEEKEEPER (1986), featuring beautiful sax solos by Jan Garbarek. But also love THE SUSPENDED STEP OF THE STORK, ETERNITY AND A DAY (one of my favourite ‘slow cinema’ films as well), THE WEEPING MEADOW and DUST OF TIME.

– Lee/Blanchard

My favourite is actually a recent one, DA 5 BLOODS. But definitely a solid relationship. Was a bit bummed that Blanchard didn’t do Lee’s latest, HIGHEST 2 LOWEST, but his orchestrator Howard Drossin did an excellent job of emulating his style.

– Avildsen/Conti

For as classic as ROCKY is, it’s impossible to beat THE KARATE KID for me, one of the films to which I have the strongest nostalgic connection.

– Singer/Ottman

These days, it’s not particularly popular to sing the praises of Bryan Singer, but there’s no doubt that this collaboration was one of the strongest of the 90s, primarily – of course – THE USUAL SUSPECTS.

– Kurosawa/Sato

I have to admit that it’s the Kurosawa/Fumio Hayasaka relationship that has made the strongest mark on me, but I aim to watch more of his films and hear Masaru Sato’s music that way.

– Gerry & Silvia Anderson/Barry Gray

I never had any personal relationship to the Anderson films, or their scores, but I’ve sampled some Gray’s music on its own and really dug it. Especially UFO. In 2019, Mark Burgess wrote a fine introductory article to the Anderson/Gray work that was a great gateway in for me.

– Petersen/Doldinger (7 movies unless I missed one)

It’s impossible beat THE NEVERENDING STORY for me, and DAS BOOT isn’t far behind. Other than that, my knowledge is relatively meager. I think I sampled VIER GEGEN DIE BANK recently, maybe after you mentioned it, Malte. On YouTube, possibly.

– Schlöndorff/Doldinger (3 only)
– Schlöndorff/Henze (3 only)

Embarassingly, I think I’ve only seen two Volker Schlöndorff films, THE TIN DRUM and the 1990 version of THE HANDMAID’S TALE, and those scores were by Maurice Jarre and Ryuichi Sakamoto, respectively. So those collaborations you mention are like a blank sheet. What’s the one I should check out?

– Wim Wenders/Jürgen Knieper

I think I’ve only seen DER HIMMEL ÜBER BERLIN of their work together. Anything else noteworthy?

– Joseph Vilsmaier/Enjott Schneider

I recently sampled a great 2CD set of Scheider’s music, but I don’t know if it for Vilsmaier. I don’t think so; I think it was some documentary work. So another pair I need to check out.

And for fun a director itself underrated for a reason 😉
– Uwe Boll/Jessica de Rooji

He, he. Yes, lots of fun have been made of poor Boll over the years, but I don’t think I’ve ever seen any of his films. Of course, even though they may all be crap, the music can still be good. I’m familiar with de Rooij, mostly by name. Her VERGISS MEIN NICHT (2012) was quite good. Not a Boll film, though.

[Malte Müller]

I never had any personal relationship to the Anderson films, or their scores, but I’ve sampled some Gray’s music on its own and really dug it. Especially UFO. In 2019, Mark Burgess wrote a fine introductory article to the Anderson/Gray work that was a great gateway in for me.

Yeah, UFO is great as is SPACE 1999 (the Wadsworth of season 2 is also good)

These days, it’s not particularly popular to sing the praises of Bryan Singer, but there’s no doubt that this collaboration was one of the strongest of the 90s, primarily – of course – THE USUAL SUSPECTS.

Wasn’t Ottman also the editor of most films? I think he basically quit scoring and only works as an editor currenty?

I think I’ve only seen DER HIMMEL ÜBER BERLIN of their work together. Anything else noteworthy?

I am by no means an expert on Wenders nor did I see all films but they worked together on basically all films since his first big movie DIE ANGST DES TORMANNS BEIM ELFMETER (1972) up to HIMMEL ÜBER BERLIN.
Have digital verison of this compilation https://www.discogs.com/de/release/3501551-J%C3%BCrgen-Knieper-Music-By-J%C3%BCrgen-Knieper-From-The-American-Friend-The-State-Of-Things-And-Rivers-Edg. There is another more complete compilation but I don’t have that: https://www.discogs.com/master/2701541-J%C3%BCrgen-Knieper-Wim-Wenders-Roadmusic-Part-12

According to sources he was last involved with LISBON STORY. Not sure if we wrotte anything as the actual score was by portuguese band MADREUS. I think Knieper is no active anymore being 85 now. Knieper was also acive in songs for political satirical shows.

I recently sampled a great 2CD set of Scheider’s music, but I don’t know if it for Vilsmaier. I don’t think so; I think it was some documentary work. So another pair I need to check out.

Schneider is very active in the concert hall, film and TV. He is also ´musicologist and was Professor for film scoring for years.
There are several compilations: A 2CD compilation (I have that one digitally and a few scores extra) and a 4 CD compilation of film and TV work including Vilsmaier ones. Then there is a newer 3CD of his documentary scores which I have on my buy list.

[Malte Müller]

It’s impossible beat THE NEVERENDING STORY for me, and DAS BOOT isn’t far behind. Other than that, my knowledge is relatively meager. I think I sampled VIER GEGEN DIE BANK recently, maybe after you mentioned it, Malte. On YouTube, possibly.

I think for me it is DAS BOOT first and then NEVERENDING STORY. Both are his master pieces. Not sure if I mentined VIER GEGEN DIE BANK but that is a nice groovy score and as the majority of Doldinger completely unreleased. More on that when my planned Doldinger filmography article is ready 😉

[Thor Joachim Haga]

Wasn’t Ottman also the editor of most films?

He was. He’s done directing too. Multi-talented fellow. These days, he posts a lot of political stuff on social media (thankfully reasonable leftist thoughts and anti-Trump messages). I do wonder what he thinks about his former partner these days, after the #metoo scandals surrounding Singer.

Thanks for the tips. You’re right, it was a 3CD set with Schneider documentary scores that I had, not a 2CD set. I don’t know where that set went. I had it digitally. Maybe it was too big as a folder, and I had to delete it.

[Malte Müller]

Thanks for the tips. You’re right, it was a 3CD set with Schneider documentary scores that I had, not a 2CD set. I don’t know where that set went. I had it digitally. Maybe it was too big as a folder, and I had to delete it.

Then you of course had a promo because like all Alhambra releases this is not available digitally at all including their 6CD compilation. A good compilation is this 2CD set which is and which I have:
https://www.discogs.com/release/27321039-Enjott-Schneider-Filmmusik

First four films / tracks 1-15 are Vilsmaier movies. Two movies are missing including the sixth and last one SCHLAFES BRUDER after which their collaboration ended. On that Hubert von Goisern was co-composer but there was no actual collaboration as far as I remember. A central piece by Schneider is an huge organ tocctata that is available separately and also source music in the movie.

[Thor Joachim Haga]

Gary Chang and Craig R Baxley/John Frankenheimer

Frankenheimer worked with several interesting composers, my favourite being Bernstein’s BIRDMAN OF ALCATRAZ, followed closely by Williams’ BLACK SUNDAY. I wasn’t aware he had a relationship with Chang that ran over more movies, but I do like THE ISLAND OF DR. MOREAU, of course, which I once had on CD. I would need to check out the rest.

Chris Franke and Bobby Roth

Is this separate from the Tangerine Dream work? (DEAD SOLID PERFECT, RAINBOW DRIVE, HEARTBREAKERS…).

Paul Haslinger and John Stockwell

Not sure I’ve heard any of these.

Mark Mancina and Antoine Fuqua

Again, my connection to Fuqua scores are non-Mancina ones. But I think I sampled SHOOTER once.

Randy Edelman and Rob Cohen

Rob Cohen…now there’s a journeyman director if there ever was one. But yes, DRAGON: THE BRUCE LEE STORY, DRAGONHEART and DAYLIGHT are all excellent scores.

J Peter Robinson and Roger Donaldson

Another journeyman director, but one step up the ladder from Cohen. Again, other composers stand out for me (primarily, of course, Vangelis’ gorgeous THE BOUNTY), but I suppose COCKTAIL is their big hit together. Have no memory of the score, though, I think it was mostly songs? I think I also sampled THE WORLD’S FASTEST INDIAN once.

Pat Metheny and Jan Egleson

Never even heard of this director. I only have the three “classic” Metheny scores (THE FALCON AND THE SNOWMAN, A MAP OF THE WORLD and PASSAGIO PAR IL PARADISO), and I don’t think he did any of those.

Nick Glennie-Smith and Randall Wallace

I always confuse Randall Wallace with Randal Kleiser, but anyway — THE MAN IN THE IRON MASK is great, and I think I sampled WE WERE SOLDIERS once. That’s about it.

Oh, Michael Nyman and Peter Greenaway!

I had a couple of those CDs once. One compilation CD, and the individual albums for THE COOK, THE THIEF, HIS WIFE AND HER LOVER and THE DRAUGHTSMAN’S CONTRACT. Went on my nerves at that time. But in later years, I’ve started to reappreciate their work, and their particular approach to minimalism. Love the quaintness, the baroque-ness of it all. Lots of crossover appeal with this pair – loved by cineastes!

And Philip Glass and Godfrey Reggio.

More hardcore minimalism than the above. People always rave (rightfully) about the -QUATSI scores, but my favourite of their work is actually the lush and suggestive VISITORS from 2013. I’m not really familiar with anything else from this pair.

[Thor Joachim Haga]

Then you of course had a promo because like all Alhambra releases this is not available digitally at all including their 6CD compilation. A good compilation is this 2CD set which is and which I have:
https://www.discogs.com/release/27321039-Enjott-Schneider-Filmmusik

First four films / tracks 1-15 are Vilsmaier movies. Two movies are missing including the sixth and last one SCHLAFES BRUDER after which their collaboration ended. On that Hubert von Goisern was co-composer but there was no actual collaboration as far as I remember. A central piece by Schneider is an huge organ tocctata that is available separately and also source music in the movie.

Thanks for the extra info! Yes, it might very well have been a promo.

[Jon Aanensen]

Franke only did two films with Roth as part of TD. He did lots of stuff for him solo from 1995-2010.

Egleson did four films with Metheny from 1985 to 1990.

NGS also did SECRETARIAT and HEAVEN IS FOR REAL with Wallace.

Robinson did 6 movies with Donaldson.

I believe Chang worked about 10 times with Frankenheimer, many in TV.

[Malte Müller]

Probably not underrated by any means but David Lean and Maurice Jarre is another collaboration. I am not familiar with it but Jarre also worked a lot with George Franju in the 50s and 60s.

[GerateWohl]

And Jarre worked quite intensively with Peter Weir.
I just read the Jarre interview in the FSM book.

[Thor Joachim Haga]

– Emmerich/Kloser & Wander

I’m probably the room’s biggest Emmerich fan (he’s maybe among my top 10 favourite filmmakers!), but obviously, the Kloser/Wander collaboration can’t stand up to David Arnold or John Williams. That being said, I really like THE DAY AFTER TOMORROW and I thought MIDWAY was much better than its reputation.

– Tykwer/Heil & Klimek

We talked a little bit about that in the PERFUME thread. Still weird to think of a director (who is also a composer) working with not one, but TWO other composers on a regular basis. Beyond PERFUME – their masterpiece – and LOLA RENNT, my connection to their work is lukewarm. Didn’t care much for CLOUD ATLAS.

– Roberto Rossellini/Renzo Rossellini

Embarassingly, I’ve only seen ROME, OPEN CITY and possibly STROMBOLI. I don’t think I’ve ever listened to any of the scores by his brother on their own.

– Nicolas Roeg/Stanely Myers

Superb collaboration, and we might as well throw Zimmer in there. Although I have a nostalgic relationship to THE WITCHES (which is one of the few times I’ve seen a film in the cinema with my mother), SIGNIFICANCE remains their magnum opus (that last cue, which is mostly Zimmer’s, is to die for!). CASTAWAY is decent too.

– Stephen Bochco/Mike Post & Pete Carpenter
– Stephen J. Cannell/Mike Post & Pete Carpenter

Other than maybe some themes on a compilation or two, I don’t think I have anything by Post or Carpenter in my collection. Bochco and Post’s LA LAW, however, remains a huge nostalgic favourite of mine. One of the few US television shows they showed on our only TV channel in Norway, usually Fridays.

Did anyone already mention Alberto Iglesias and Pedro Almodóvar?

They fare pretty well in cineaste circles. I was a never a big fan of either, to be honest (shocking, I know). But I did stumble drunkenly out of a pub in Ghent with Iglesias some 15 years ago.

Goblin and Dario Argento?

As we touched on earlier, HUGE names in cineaste circles, or cult circles. I’d be hardpressed to call them underrated. For many years, SUSPIRIA was the only Goblin soundtrack in my collection. A few years ago, I wanted to explore their work more. What I found was that they wrote AMAZING themes, but the rest of the scores usually left me cold. So I settled with some custom-made compilations of themes. It’s weird that the “body of their work” didn’t connect more with me, since I’m a big fan of both prog rock and electronics.

And there’s Nathan and Rian Johnson.

Cousins! Both this and the Rossellini brothers could have been put in the “It runs in the family” thread. LOOPER had some interesting things going on, otherwise I’m not a big fan. Not a big fan of the KNIVES OUT films either.

And Thomas Newman with Sam Mendes.

Pretty famous pair. I like the “trilogy” of AMERICAN BEAUTY, ROAD TO PERDITION and REVOLUTIONARY ROAD. The rest doesn’t ignite me much. My own choice for underrated Thomas Newman collaborations, as mentioned in my post earlier, is Jon Avnet. In particular LESS THAN ZERO, FRIED GREEN TOMATOES, THE WAR and UP CLOSE AND PERSONAL. RED CORNER is rather boring, at least I felt that way when I sold my CD years ago. Perhaps it’s ripe for a re-evaluation.

And maybe Gabriel Yared and Anthony Minghella. But I think, they also just ha 3 movies together.

Another pretty classic pair. Four movies, actually. THE ENGLISH PATIENT, THE TALENTED MR. RIPLEY, COLD MOUNTAIN and BREAKING AND ENTERING. Minghella often used a lot of existing music, with which Yared had to contend. THE ENGLISH PATIENT remains my favourite, but the most interesting score was probably BREAKING AND ENTERING, with Yared collaborating with Underworld. I’m not totally sold on the end result, but the pairing was odd and cool!

[Malte Müller]

’m probably the room’s biggest Emmerich fan (he’s maybe among my top 10 favourite filmmakers!),

Can’t say I am a huge fan but I certainly was entertained with his movies and saw most of them. My first encounter was MOON 44 I saw in VHS at a friend’s. I know I also saw his first THE ARCHE NOAH PRINZIP once he did in film school still but must have been on TV.

I don’t think I have anything by Post or Carpenter in my collection.

No wonder, because not much has been released. TThere are a handful albums only – two are even re-recordings – and Post himself has not much interest in it at all. I should do a discography for him at some time maybe or try an incomplete filmography but that would be really huge, they did so many things. Tried tot collect bits and pieces I found, as a lot is quite obsure besides the well know shows.
Post had a kind of composer factory similar to Zimmer where he and Carpenter did the theme(s) and some episodes while other composers like Velton Ray Bunch, Walter Murphy and others did the scores based on that. But they got credit for that at least later.

[Thor Joachim Haga]

DAS ARCHE NOAH PRINZIP is the only Emmerich work I haven’t seen. I know the whole thing is on YouTube, but the sound/image quality is terrible. I’m kinda waiting – naïvely, perhaps – that someone will clean it up and restore it first. In this A.I. age of ours, who knows?

[Jon Aanensen]

Seriously, this sound and image quality looks totally fine.

[Thor Joachim Haga]

Hmmm. Appears to be a new upload from the last time I checked (which was a couple of years ago). Does indeed look a bit better. Thanks!

[Malte Müller]

For me the above video says “unavailable in my country for legal reasons”. There is this German version which also looks good but that might be blocked for you instead ;-):

The verson seems even to be generally legal. The movie otherwise is available on DVD/BluRay, too. Btw, I encountered the soundtrack some years before the saw the movie on a sampler with synth cover version (the music is of course already synth9:

[Thor Joachim Haga]

Yes, your video does not work for me, Malte. But I had no idea it was released on physical format, and that even the theme was released on an album!

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