[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Whatever music one enjoys is a personal thing, and depends on many factors. And of course nostalgia can play a role, but that role isn’t limited to film music. Sure you can have a nostalgic association with a film score, where you grew up loving the movie and so you like the music, but you can just as well have a nostalgic association with that pop song played when you were first in love, or that jazz piece that you associate with that favorite bar you used to go to decades ago.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

I have about 35 Thomas Newman albums, and yes, I like him a lot. I agree with Thor, his scores always sound like him, and there is a calm, textural quality to most of his output I very much enjoy. Newman’s music is at times the musical equivalent to relaxing on a warm summer afternoon.

Favorite scores of his are AMERICAN BEAUTY (very original at the time, everybody copied it… quirky), SCENT OF A WOMAN, ANGELS IN AMERICA (one of his more dramatic scores, a great album), THE HORSE WHISPERER and MEET JOE BLACK.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

As I said in the related FSM thread, I think in many ways, John Williams is right. Lots of film music is dull or uninspired, simply uninteresting. A lot of film music is just serviceable. It’s composers like Miklós Rózsa, Bernard Herrmann, Alex North, Leonard Rosenman, Jerry Goldsmith, Ennio Morricone that showed film music doesn’t have to be and can be more, but of course a lot of is just forgettable.

Then let’s not forget that Williams has a more modest demeanor to begin with, and some people don’t think much of what they themselves do or have accomplished. Marlon Brando was one of the most respected and revered actors in Hollywood ever, yet he didn’t think highly of acting as a profession, and — like Williams in the interview here — though of it as a good way to make money.

Some of the things Williams said are just blatantly obvious, like “the idea that film music has the same place in the concert hall as the best music in the canon is a mistaken notion, I think”. Well, yeah, to compare “film music” (hundreds of new ones every year) to “the best music in the canon”, well, yeah… can’t argue with that. A lot of film music is ephemeral and fragmentary, and just not very interesting.
However, film music can be as good as any “classical” work, it just usually isn’t.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

I’ve been a fan of Philip Glass ever since I heard KOYAANISQATSI. I was still in school back, but had a summer internthip at the German distributor of the film, so I got access to all the promotional material, posters, flyers, press books… soundtrack LPs. 🙂
I was music unlike any music I had ever heard, it was neither “classical” classical music, nor was it “modern” classical music, it was something new. It’s the musical equivalent of a mosaic.
I very much like Philip Glass, from his piano Études to his operas (especially Akhnaten). I think his operas, and again especially Akhnaten, while abstract, are probably the most dramatic music Glass has ever written. His largest scale work is probably ITAIPU, which features a large orchestra as well as a large chorus. So yes, Glass has been a “fixture” in my music collection ever since KOYAANISQATSI, which I did see performed live to picture, with Glass at the Keyboard. It’s the type of movie where such concerts actually make sense.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

My first “encounter” with Max Richter was when I was browsing in my local record store and picked up an interesting looking album: Vivaldi – The Four Seasons Recomposed by Max Richter.
Was an interesting composition, clearly Vivaldi on the one hand, clearly modern relaxing minimalism on the other. I liked that. And of course I encountered what may be his most famous composition, “On the nature of Daylight” at various times and in various places.
I’m also fascinated by his mammoth album project “Sleep” (and it’s many tie-in albums, like “From Sleep”, “Sleep Tranquility Base”, etc.). Indeed very absorbing, meditative music.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

That was done back in the day of VHS quite often. Movies were shot for wide screens, like 2.20:1 or 2.39:1 ration. Depending on how the negative of the movie is, VHS movies could be shown “letterboxed” (the classic film format, on TV sets of the time then with black bars top and bottom), or “cropped” (meaning the image would be zoomed in until it filled the screen, but you’d lose the image right and/or left (“pan & scan”), or “open matte.
In case of JACOBS LADDER it was then apparently “open matte”, which means while the movie was shot for the wide screen, a larger part of the negative was used for the VHS copy (so top and/or bottom of the picture “opened”), which means that sometimes there are things visible that should not be visible (and were not visible on the film print). Directors and editor usually select what is shown in the frame, but when a copy for VHS is done, sometimes, the frame was just enlarged to fill the 4.3 screen, that’s when microphones or other stuff may enter the picture.
I’m so happy the days of this are over. 😀
I never like VHS pan & scan or open matte versions, but that’s the way movies were released back then.

Edit:
A famous example of how different frames effect the experience is Stanley Kubrick’s SHINING. Kubrick shot the movie with an eye on BOTH widescreen (for the theatrical release) and the 4:3 format, which at that time was the format TV screens had. Which is why the 4:3 version of Shining was officially approved.

Here’s an example of how Shining looks in either version (you can find these clips on YouTube):

This is matted widescreen and “open matte” TV image. Kubrick kept the microphones out of either. However, most directors who shot their films in wide screen never intended them to be shown “open matte”, which is why (as in case of Jacob’s Ladder), they did not mind microphones (or planes, or signs, or whatever) show up in a part of the frame they knew was not shown later on. Unless someone copied them to VHS “open matte”.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

The first time I noticed Wojciech Kilar was from the French animated movie Le Roi et l’Oiseau. That movie has as an interesting production history, as it started in 1948 but it wasn’t until the early 1980s that it was actually finished. It’s a wonderful film, quite different from the more prominent Disney animated features. I still got the original soundtrack LP from the 1980s.
I loved Kilar’s music for this, and (in some concert guide books we had, this was way before the internet) found out he was at that time also a know concert composer.
So my first encounter with Kilar’s music was for an enchanting fairy tale animated movie.

Years later, I was excited when I saw his name on the then upcoming Coppola Dracula movie.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Gorecki not as far as I know, I think Lutoslawski did very early in his career, though not for any “important” feature films, and not later in life.

Francis Ford-Coppola wanted that “Eastern European avant-gardish classical” sound for his Dracula movie, and he asked Lutoslawski, who told Coppola it takes him way too long to write a single minute of music to be commissioned for a film score. That’s how Coppola came to Kilar, who not only belonged to the Polish “triumvirate” (Penderecki, Gorecki, Kilar), but was also an experienced film composer.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Yeah, I noticed and wanted to ask you “wow, that’s a lot of John Williams recordings… what do you have?” I did check my own (considerable, but not as large as yours) John Williams collection. When I typed in “John Williams”, I get results for 170 albums and 12-13 days long, and so I was wondering what the heck am I missing? My actual “John Williams” albums are fewer, because just typing in “John Williams”, the programs also list compilations such as AMAZING STORIES where Williams appears, plus even unrelated recordings by the guitarist John Williams. I have about 125 albums or 9 days of listening time where the composer “John Williams” is the “Album Artist”.

I don’t have any expansions, so that means less minutes there.

That, plus I sometimes (not always) combine two albums into one. When I have both an expanded album and the OST, or the identical album in two different masters, I often combine them in my collection under one “Main Album” (if necessary, the individual discs would then be tagged with the mastering or release information or whatever)

For example here is Presumed Innocent:
Disc 1 is the Varèse Deluxe Edition, Disc 2 is the OST. They are of course two different releases, but in my collection they take up one “album slot”.

That explains my above average album lengths.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

I’ll check them out.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

I’ve got two Abel Korzeniowski scores, TILL and THE WATCHERS, though I’m not really familiar with them yet. They ended up in my collection, but I have not given them a listen yet.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

There are a lot of things I like about PROMETHEUS, it’s a great looking film, with a potentially intriguing premise. It’s in some ways a real “science fiction” film and less of a monster spectacle, and the look reminded me of some of the Analog Magazine covers I enjoyed so much. However, I don’t know why the writers ever thought they could get away with such nincompoop scientists, who were actually supposed to be the experts in their field. 🙂

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Well, many consider and mention John Barry as a “British Composer”, even though he worked a lot in Hollywood and actually had American Citizenship, so I consider Zimmer, who does not even have American Citizenship, German, even though he works a lot in Hollywood.
A lot of higher end talent eventually ends up in Hollywood, as that’s where the money is, and often more creative freedom.

I remember in an interview where Roland Emmerich where he was quite frustrated with the German film industry and said he just can’t do the movies he wants to do in Germany.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Yes, it was the one with two images.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

As far as film music goes, the first two that came to my mind, Preisner and Kilar.
Wojciech Kilar is one of my favorites, he’s just a terrific composer, not just film. I also have and enjoy film scores by Jan A.P. Kaczmarek and Krzysztof Komeda… I think Krzysztof Penderecki has composed a few film scores, but I’m not familiar with any of them. Wasn’t Bronisław Kaper originally from Poland? Ah, he was, indeed… (I just googled it… unless Google lied to me again. 🙂 ) Though I connect Kaper with the Hollywood Golden Age.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Funny thing is (and I just posted this at FSM), I put two search queries into Google today

1. Directors who went to film school
2. Directors who never went to film school

Here ware the first results of what Google Gemini listed:

Obviously, you cannot just rely on the first thing Google (Gemini) presents you, you have to cross reference and verify things.

A.I. is like any other tool, it can do some things exceptionally well, more efficiently than any human, yet fails at other, for humans simple tasks.

But we’re just in the beginning era of widespread use of A.I., it’s basically “toddler age”, and the development is remarkably swift. So many things the A.I. could not do just half a year ago, it can now do with ease. So it will progress.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Seems like an answer of mine is once again in digital limbo…

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

I don’t have Disney+, so I’m not watching the show (yet…maybe it’ll be elswhere some day).
I admit I’m somewhat skeptical about Alien working as a TV series.
I loved the original ALIEN. It was a classic science-fiction monster movie, the type of which had been done before (with Mario Bava’s PLANET OF THE VAMPIRES an obvious predecessor, though Scott said he had not even seen the film… but the similarities are nevertheless obvious), but ALIEN was the first time such a movie was constructed with A-level production values. The monster-bursting-out-of-chest scene was at that time a harrowingly shocking scene, well done. The idea of Ash being a robot was a further, excellent plot twist. ALIENS then was a great sequel, because it didn’t try to do the exact same thing as before, but put marines up against aliens. ALIEN3 had its issues, but I liked the atmosphere, Fincher’s direction, and Elliot Goldenthal’s evocative music score. I did not care all that much for ALIEN: RESURRECTION, but I liked PROMETHEUS more than most (not because I don’t see its obvious flaws, but because I enjoyed that it tried to do some new things). That’s it, I haven’t watched any of the other Alien movies, though I do have ALIEN:COVENANT on Bluray for a rainy day.

There is a tendency in all of these franchises that go on for too long to overexplain this or that, and I don’t like the idea of de-mystifying the Xenomorphs too much. I don’t even like the idea that they were created as some sort of “biological weapon”… a “weapon” the wielder cannot control at all is rather silly. I find them much more interesting, and frightening, as naturally evolved but highly dangerous creature, that may have been part of a different eco system on a different planet where it fit in, but once it was taken out, is highly dangerous because it no longer has any natural “enemies”. The original Alien is one of the best designed alien creatures ever, it deserves to haven an aura of mystery around it.
As far as ALIEN:EARTH is concerned, I might give it a try one day.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Ha! That’s pretty cool. And a bit eerie, as always with A.I. Although I don’t know how well you feel it represented you?

My collection is too eclectic — they wouldn’t be able to make a profile.

Well, who knows what it would come up with. As far as I well it represented me, not sure… it actually took what probably most people would gather from the collection one way or another. Let’s see…

I’m definitely detail-oriented, introspective and have a deep passion for music as an art form and storytelling medium. I’m also in my 40s to 60s. So that’s true.

However, I don’t think I my connection to the music and films of the late 20th century is mostly or strongly nostalgic. I also don’t think my approach to music is “scholarly”… I just enjoy it… of course, that includes that I like to learn or find out about music. Not sure how much of an audiophile I am, though I do have an interest in high-fidelity and audio technology. Ok, audio sound quality is of considerable importance to me.
So it fits by and large, I guess, but reveals no deeper secrets about me.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Too much information! 😀

By all means, it beats looking at pictures of myself while wanking! 🙂

Though those are actually just among the “ambient” albums, quite atmospheric and not necessarily limited to… well, there’s actual music on there… it’s like, you know, when you buy the Playboy for the stories and not… oh, sheesh, I’m not sure that’s the way out of it… well, nevermind…

Anyway, there are some albums there that I’d have never bought. First of all, my wife’s entire CD collection (which is just couple dozen albums tops) is “absorbed” in mine, so they are not separate entities.

And there are more embarrassing obscurities in that collection. I once ordered a used copy of Basil Poledouris IT’S MY PARTY from a platform… what arrived was an album called IT’S MY PARTY… but it was a strange collection of children’s party songs… Heck if I know. I did send the album back and I got my money back, but I nevertheless made a copy of that album… and it’s in there somewhere.
That’s perhaps the album I would cringe the most if someone points to that. But it’s all there, warts and all…

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

I couldn’t do that; my wife’s home… and my office is also at home. 🙂

Though to understand A.I. and how it works, you have to put it to the grinder on familiar territory first. And what best to use something I know.

I use A.I. to analyze marketing performances (that’s part of my “day job”, no fancy film work), so it’s of course interesting to see the conclusions A.I. draws from limited facts. I got six pages out of Grok, and I find it very interesting how it proceeds and what it concludes.
For example, it gave good overview of what you’d find in my collection:

Excerpt from the Grok Analysis of the collection:

1. Dominance of Film Scores:
• The collection includes numerous film soundtracks, with prominent composers like Jerry Goldsmith (e.g., Star Trek, Basic Instinct, The Blue Max), John Williams (Star Wars, Superman, Indiana Jones), James Horner (Titanic, Avatar), Ennio Morricone (The Untouchables, A Fistful of Dollars), Hans Zimmer (Blade Runner 2049, The Thin Red Line), and others. These span various genres, including science fiction (Star Trek, Aliens), westerns (The Big Country, True Grit), and thrillers (The Silence of the Lambs, Vertigo).
• Many entries are deluxe or expanded editions (e.g., Superman FSM Blue Box, Back to the Future trilogy), suggesting a deep interest in the complete, detailed versions of scores, often with a focus on rare or archival releases from labels like La-La Land, Intrada, and Varèse Sarabande.
• This indicates a collector’s mindset, with a preference for cinematic storytelling, emotional depth, and possibly nostalgia tied to iconic films.
2. Extensive Classical Music Collection:
• The collection features a significant number of classical works, with a strong focus on composers like Johann Sebastian Bach (e.g., Goldberg Variations in multiple versions, Brandenburg Concertos), Ludwig van Beethoven (Complete Symphonies by various conductors, Piano Sonatas), Richard Strauss (Also Sprach Zarathustra, Eine Alpensinfonie), Igor Stravinsky (Le Sacre du Printemps), and Antonio Vivaldi (The Four Seasons).
• Multiple recordings of the same work (e.g., Bach’s Goldberg Variations by Gould, Perahia, Lang Lang, etc.) suggest a fascination with interpretive differences and a scholarly approach to music.
• The inclusion of 20th-century composers like Béla Bartók, Alban Berg, and Philip Glass, alongside more avant-garde figures like Karlheinz Stockhausen, points to an appreciation for both traditional and experimental classical music.
3. Jazz and Vocal Artists:
• Jazz is well-represented with artists like Miles Davis (Bitches Brew, A Tribute to Jack Johnson), Thelonious Monk (Solo Monk, Underground), and Ella Fitzgerald (BD Jazz: Ella Fitzgerald). The presence of both classic and experimental jazz suggests an appreciation for improvisation and emotional expression.
• Vocalists like Anna Netrebko, Diana Krall, and Sarah Vaughan indicate a taste for emotive, lyrical performances, often with a sophisticated or intimate style.
4. Pop, Rock, and Contemporary Artists:
• The collection includes select pop/rock artists like Sting (…Nothing Like The Sun, Ten Summoner’s Tales), Phil Collins (…But Seriously, Testify), Tori Amos (Boys for Pele, Under the Pink), and Lana Del Rey (Born to Die, Ultraviolence). These artists are known for introspective, emotionally rich, or narrative-driven music.
• Other entries like Eurythmics, Madonna, and U2 suggest an interest in 1980s and 1990s pop/rock with a focus on thematic or conceptual albums.
5. Eclectic and Niche Interests:
• The collection includes ambient and electronic music (e.g., Brian Eno’s Ambient 1: Music for Airports, Tangerine Dream’s Sorcerer), as well as world music and New Age (e.g., Loreena McKennitt, Vangelis). This reflects an openness to diverse sonic experiences.
• Specialized genres like tantric music (50 Amour tantrique, 50 Sexual Awakening) and audiophile test recordings (Stereophile Test CD, Audio Sound Test Files) suggest a focus on sensory experience and high-fidelity sound quality.
• The inclusion of video game soundtracks (Tomb Raider, Baldur’s Gate 3) and television scores (Battlestar Galactica, Westworld) indicates an interest in modern media beyond traditional films.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Here’s something. I’m currently working and exploring a lot with A.I., so for fun I exported my music collection via MusicBee to Excel, just the albums. I then imported the music collection to GROK with the following prompt:

Exact Prompt:
Act as a specialist FBI profiler. This is a music collection. Analyze and try to give as accurate as possible a personality profile of the person who has accumulated this exact music collection. Examine the evidence and present a likely picture of the the person whose music collection this is. You are allowed to ask questions if that helps you with the task.

Grok delivered a lengthy analysis (6 pages!) of the music collection, taking a look at the various genres it found, and what this suggests for the individual. Was quite interesting

It started with:

To create a personality profile of the individual who has accumulated this extensive music collection, I’ll analyze the provided data as an FBI profiler would, focusing on patterns, preferences, and potential psychological insights derived from the collection. The collection, documented in the “Library of ALAC Albums.xlsx” file, contains entries spanning a wide range of genres, artists, and eras, with a strong emphasis on film scores, classical music, jazz, and select pop/rock artists. Below, I’ll break down the analysis into key observations, followed by a detailed personality profile.

Then it continues an in depth look at the various genres it found (film score, classical, jazz, etc.) and what the select recordings probably indicate. Goes on for a while, quite interesting.

The final summary looked then like:

Likely Picture of the Individual:
The individual behind this music collection is likely a highly intellectual, detail-oriented, and introspective person with a deep passion for music as an art form and storytelling medium. They are probably in their 40s to 60s, with a strong nostalgic connection to the music and films of the late 20th century, particularly the 1980s and 1990s. Their collection reflects a scholarly approach to music, with an emphasis on completeness, quality, and historical significance, suggesting a personality that values knowledge, precision, and emotional depth. They are likely an audiophile, with an interest in high-fidelity sound and possibly audio technology. While they may enjoy solitary activities like curating their collection, their global and eclectic tastes suggest an open-minded, culturally curious individual who appreciates the intersection of music, film, and history. Professionally or as a hobby, they may be involved in music, film, or a related field, or they could simply be a dedicated enthusiast with a lifelong commitment to collecting and preserving music. This profile is a hypothesis based on the patterns in the collection. Additional information about the individual’s motivations, lifestyle, or personal history would help refine this analysis further.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Though “Expanded Editons” vs. OST isn’t necessarily the same topic as re-buying a recording.

I didn’t re-buy SUPERMAN so often because of additional material, but because of the updated mixes and mastering. In case of SUPERMAN, that was a worthy investment.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

I mentioned PERFUME in the first post, and to me, that is still Tykwer (& co.)’s best score, in addition to LOLA RENNT. I think he had a new score out recently, name escapes me at the moment, but it wasn’t very impressive.

Last score I remember from Tom Tykwer was The Matrix Resurrections, but that’s a couple of years old now.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

I’ve bought a number of recordings more than once, a few more than twice, depending on how important a score is to me and whether I consider the new release offers a (substantial) upgrade over the previous one. Sometimes the upgrade was really worth it, sometimes it wasn’t. 🙂 But SUPERMAN is the title I bought the most.

One film score I love where I was always dissatisfied with the previous releases was Jerry Goldsmith’s PAPILLON. The Silva Screen release lacked substantial moments of the score didn’t sound too well, the Universal France added the missing music, but still didn’t sound good (though differently bad than the Silva Screen), and the Quartet… voila, everything fell into place, full program, great sound.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Maybe worth mentioning is the soundtrack that I bought the most often.

The soundtrack (and even the recording, regardless of any genre) I bought most often is SUPERMAN – THE MOVIE. I do have the original WB Double LP, then the Warner CD of that (minus two tracks, which at that time had to be dropped to accommodate a single disc CD release), then the Rhino 2CD release, then the FSM “Blue Box”, and then, last but not least, the La-La Land 40th Anniversary 3CD release.

Plus I also have the John Debney recording with the Royal Scottish National Orchestra (though that’s a different recording, that’s more like in classical music, when you have several “Eroicas”).

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

That’s interesting, because my music is filed without regard to genre. So in my CD shelf, “Madonna”, “Gustav Mahler”, and “Henry Mancini” are all next to each other or in close proximity.
Because I see music (like books or films) fits often into more than one genre, I do have my genres very generic, so there is “pop”, “jazz”, “classical”, “score” (or soundtrack), “ambient”, “electronic”… not much more.
If more programs supported multiple genres across the board, I’d assign multiple genres to lot of recordings.

So I’m not even sure if I have every main genre in my collection as defined by Thor.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

But going into the parameters of sorting is a whole other, complex topic in itself that I won’t delve into here.

Yeah, that would be a different topic. This is just for fun.

I seem to have 18 different versions of “Jingle Bells” in my collection, which means I can play “Jingle Bells” continuously for 49 minutes without playing the same track twice. 😀

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Perfect reply. Exactly the spirit in which this thread was created. 🙂

Yes, except for the fact that I made a mistake while browsing iTunes. It’s if I played my ENTIRE COLLECTION (all 2877 albums worth), that it would stop at November 11. If I only played my Williams collection (some 280 titles), it would stop August 19 if I pressed ‘play’ today. So bit of a difference, LOL. 😀

Yeah, I noticed and wanted to ask you “wow, that’s a lot of John Williams recordings… what do you have?” I did check my own (considerable, but not as large as yours) John Williams collection. When I typed in “John Williams”, I get results for 170 albums and 12-13 days long, and so I was wondering what the heck am I missing? My actual “John Williams” albums are fewer, because just typing in “John Williams”, the programs also list compilations such as AMAZING STORIES where Williams appears, plus even unrelated recordings by the guitarist John Williams. I have about 125 albums or 9 days of listening time where the composer “John Williams” is the “Album Artist”.

[Nicolai P. Zwar]

Great movie, and I also enjoy the score.

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