Eirik Myhr
Forumsvar Lagt Inn
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Innlegg
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I am not the biggest Zimmer fan either. I find his typical and often parodied style a bit too «sound design» based for my tastes, and it sounds like he really wants the orchestra to sound like a synth. Which is fine I guess, but I get what you are saying about how he is «treating» the orchestra. Those big chords and the larger-than-life percussion banging away like you’re constantly out of breath, like the Pirates stuff, that’s what I’m really tired of. Almost as tired as I am of all that BRAAAAAM-obsessed hack’n’slash trailer music. Yawn!
Having said that, he does sometimes surprise me. I might be the only person in the world to say this, but my favourite Zimmer score is the small drama comedy SPANGLISH, which is so beautiful and lyrical. Highly recommended.
I get the feeling that when Zimmer really thrives, it’s when he gets to do exactly what he feels like, like with SPANGLISH. But more often than not, maybe he gets type-cast because producers or directors want that «Big Zimmer Sound»? Still, he manages to expand and do something really creative within that «big» sound, like with Nolan’s films. I liked INCEPTION because the melodies (or really chord progressions) themselves were interesting and a bit unexpected. Nevertheless, it’s often a kind of music that I find a bit exhausting to listen to.
And funny that you should mention HANNIBAL – which is also one of my very few Zimmer CD’s, because I find «Vide Cor Meum» SO STAGGERINGLY beautiful. But as I found out, that was not written by Zimmer at all, but by Patrick Cassidy.
What about ED WOOD? I remember that one as having quite a few good cues, and a very cool sound in general. With congas, theremin and «sirup-y» string arrangements, really nailing the period it was meant to be a homage to, while still feeling kind of fresh. I also think he balanced the fine art of being Elfman’s replacement, understanding the style but still not «becoming» Elfman, quite well.
I want to punch that red-haired cretin in the face every day.
For many more reasons than this – so do I. And I’m pretty much a pacifist.
you know the style… and that included most of Mancini’s soundtrack albums of the day and what not. When I seriously started listening to music as a teenager, you could give me Stravinsky, Ligeti, Boulez, Schnitte, anything with thorns and spikes, but if you gave me “easy listening”, and you ensured my disdain.
The label “Easy listening” IS kind of an insult to the music, as it implies a “hollow” kind of nonsense music that anyone could make. In later years, I’ve come to see this very particular kind of old vintage “library music” as sort of a lost art form. You now have a small wave of artists from the alternative/indie scene who have embraced this strange old genre, and are creating some really cool new stuff inspired by it.
Having said that, I still find it a bit too harsh to label Mancini as “easy listening”. Some of Mancini’s lounge-cocktail-pop-jazz tunes from his 60s and 70s scores simply has so much CLASS and complexity. Just listen to those intricate thick jazz chords from the string section in the original opening to the first Pink Panther movie, for instance. It is art. In his later years, he manages to take traces of those cocktail jazz-pop melodies and turn it into something hauntingly beautiful, like my personal Mancini favourite, MOMMIE DEAREST (never seen the film, but MAN, what a score).
Maybe the best version of Fauré’s Requiem I’ve heard (can’t decide between this one and the one by Herreweghe on Harmonia Mundi).
Such a breathtakingly beautiful work.I listen to albums, not archives™
I listen to both! Agree with almost everything said in this thread by Nick and Graham.
Sometimes I want a curated album, sometimes I want to study the complete work, as an actual film music “study item”. Agree very much that it is a case-by-base thing. Not just composer by composer, but also how personally invested I am in the particular film or score. John Williams I almost always prefer as C&C (sorry Thor :D). Agree what was said about Zimmer as well, but then he does something like THE LION KING, where I absolutely want the C&C of the Disney Legacy edition, with the whole evolving flow of the songs and the score, and how the themes bounce off each other.What I actually don’t care for is when they have the original album first on a disc, then just stick in all the non-album tracks at the end as “bonus tracks”. That leaves me with the task of crafting my own C&C album or playlist, which to me just feels wrong (not to mention time-consuming)… This is sadly the case with BIG FISH, one of my favourite Elfman scores. The original album was so full of pop/rock tracks (by other artists), and the score part was really just the second half of the album (if not less). When the Elfman/Burton box set was released in 2010, they dropped all the pop/rock tracks that originally started the album, which left the “original album” part ridiculously short, and then added all the other cues as “bonus tracks” at the end. That felt like a really bad compromise, unfinished and kind of butchered. I still want a C&C release of that score. And please, for the STAR WARS prequels as well… 🙂
What a great thread!
Music has always been in my life, as I was drumming on cardboard boxes and improvising melodies before I could talk. Using the full size drum kit my parents were loving enough (or stupid enough, depending on who you ask) to get me as a Christmas present when I was five, combined with my parents’ piano, my sister’s Casio synthesizer and my voice, I created hundreds of lo-fi cassette tapes with questionable material.
The music I listened to as a kid was pretty diverse – my dad (kind of a music geek) was playing a lot of Frank Zappa, which I today regard as a genius composer. I got really into Genesis, both their 70s prog rock days and their 80s pop-flavoured periods. I still enjoy all those albums more than ever, and know them word for word, note for note. But in the early 90s I also liked some of the harder kinds of rock that was emerging, like Nirvana and Rage Against the Machine.
My way into film music was probably through gaming, as I was not really interested in movies as a kid. I remember also watching a lot of TV series and noticing the name Mike Post appearing in almost every one of them – funny that I’m not alone in this! But around the time I turned 10 (early 90s), I got really into PC games, and in particular, those wonderful point-and-click adventure games from LucasArts and Sierra. I am still in awe of all those great LucasArts soundtracks by the likes of Michael Z. Land and Peter McConnell, especially. The music of SAM & MAX HIT THE ROAD (1993) might have some small part in making jazz my primary music interest from this point and throughout my teenage years, which was very much appreciated by my dad, but totally frowned upon by every other 10 year old in my class, obviously. After a while, I discovered that LucasArts (or Lucasfilm Games as it was originally called) was a daughter company of Lucasfilm, and that there was this thing called STAR WARS…
I rented and watched the STAR WARS Original Trilogy on VHS, and was hooked for life. Later, in 1997 when the Special Editions were released, I bought all the double disc releases, listened to them all while reading the liner notes with great care… Suddenly I understood that all these themes I’ve heard countless times (and not just the main theme and the Imperial March) actually MEANT something, that nothing was random. Every rendition of every theme had a distinct meaning, and John Williams was indeed a genius. Something clicked in my head, and I knew that somehow, I had to be a film composer. I was now 15.
I don’t really know how to tell the rest of the story. While going to a music-oriented high school and later studying music at University in the early 2000s, I played in a lot of different bands as drummer, keyboard player and singer, but still had this solo thing going on where I created instrumental music which was more geared towards film music, even though I still did not listen to a lot of film music actively, other than John Williams. After a while I started taking notice that I also really loved Danny Elfman’s music, especially his more mature work like BIG FISH (2003). John Williams’ music of the STAR WARS prequels also still stand for me as some of his most interesting work, in addition to many of his more experimental 2000s scores like A.I. ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE (maybe my single biggest favourite of his to this day).
I’ve now been a composer for theatre, film and TV since 2006. I’ve also listened to more film scores than I did as a kid. In addition to Williams and Elfman, I also really enjoy some scores by Mancini, Zimmer, Menken, Silvestri, and I also like some works by Desplat and Giacchino, though I can’t say I know their portfolio that much. I am hardly a film music encyclopedia like many of you guys are! These days, I probably listen the most to classical music – Grieg, Dvořák, Ravel, Fauré and Bach in particular. But also Tchaikovsky, Stravinsky, Beethoven, Saint-Saëns and others. I know that many of these have been inspirations to many of our greatest film composers, and getting more into their music, it’s not hard to understand why. Grieg’s PEER GYNT (1876!) is a complete 90 minute-ish epic theatre score, with some of the most wonderful themes imaginable, and not that far from a film score at all. For anyone curious, just let me know if you want to know which recordings to start with, as that kind of thing makes a BIG difference in classical music. It quickly becomes an obsession to find the performance and the recording that you find the most “right”…
As for my own music, I will try to let you know about new releases, hopefully without spamming too much.
Easy one, as I haven’t really attended that many of them…
As you will remember, Thor, we both attended a certain Elfman/Burton concert in London, October 7th 2013… We didn’t know there would be many more of them, as this was promoted as a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. This was also the first time Danny sang on stage in many many years, as Jack Skellington, and he looked very awkward at first. But gradually, he started to really shine, and really enjoy the whole thing. He sang every note perfectly, started dancing, and was really on fire. It got so good that he closed off by saying “Thank you for giving me what I believe is the single greatest moment in my life”, or something to that extent. There was a strong feeling of witnessing a historic event..!
My gut feeling has always been that Elfman thought that he would hate doing it, therefore only announcing one show. Instead he found that he loved it, and wanted to do it again, and so it became a series of concerts instead… I’m sure the income is another motivator, but I really have this feeling that he really only intended to do this once, until this moment where everything clicked, and he rediscovered the joy of being of stage, right before our eyes.
That’s me with actual hair, and beardless Thor.Chiming in to wish everyone a happy easter! 🐣
Good to be back on the forum, and what a great idea to bring it back, Thor!
In this age of Facebook Fatigue™, I have often missed the good old-fashioned messageboard format.Thanks for the kind words. My theatre score for THE LEGEND OF NARNIA: THE LION, THE WITCH AND THE WARDROBE (which is in fact the first new stage dramatisation in over 40 years to be approved by the C.S. Lewis estate!) will be released in full in the autumn. But before that, there will be three singles, the first one already in one week. You can in fact pre-save it here: https://frontl.ink/kaqbqgn
This is a difficult one..!
I think if you put so much restraints on the new composer(s) so that he or she has to almost “disregard” their own style to make it sound the way Star Wars has “always” sounded, you have already lost. Even John Williams himself took the music in a lot of new directions with the prequel trilogy (and did some of the best work of his career, IMHO). I’m sure he wouldn’t want his followers to imitate his style or styles, more than doing their own thing.
That’s why I would prefer someone other than Giacchino, who would maybe stick too much to the pastiche thing.
That said, I don’t exactly want a Daft Punk or a Trent Reznor Star Wars either. Neither do I want a Hans Zimmer Star Wars.Someone who doesn’t stray too far away from the classical way, with an orchestra and with themes, but still has their own voice to add to it, instead of just imitating Williams.
James Newton Howard might not be a bad idea…
